| Author |
Message |
Kama
Devadasi
Gender: Female
Rishi
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# Posted: 30 Dec 2006 15:27
We have discussed the death penalty in depth in the Death Buses thread, but I am interested to consider the execution of Saddam... was it just the victors arranging "justice" to suit their own prejudice ?
It is interesting that the Kurds wanted Saddam to stay alive so he could be tried for the crimes he committed against their community.
It is hard to imagine someone who "deserved" the death penalty more than Saddam, but I am not sure the execution of a 69 year old tyrant will actually help anyone...
I believe Sex with Men is Divine and draws me closer to my Gods. Kama's website |
hockberg
Member
Gender: Male
Bhakta
|
# Posted: 30 Dec 2006 20:54 - Edited by: hockberg
George Bush: Today Saddam Hussein was executed after receiving a fair trial - the kind of justice he denied the victims of his brutal regime.
This had nothing to do with 'justice' for the Iraqi people.
George bush and his goons couldn't find Bin Laden, so they needed to find other 'head' to parade before the American people for the events of September 11th.
A bitter family saga is at an end.
Obituary.
I'm just tired of living in a world which the majority feel that solving violent problems is done by adding more violence.
It would have been nice for the 'new' Iraqi government to make a stand and say this is a new way forward, we will not use killing as a way of controlling the people... we are bigger than Saddam.
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rauri
Member
Gender: N/A
Bhakta
|
# Posted: 31 Dec 2006 09:11
They only tried him on charges that didn't need have evidence brought out that would have shown U.S. support for Saddam in the past.
In the same way as the U.S. supported Karimov in Uzbekistan, who is very similar to Saddam.
As for the death penalty, it's just brutal revenge after a show trial.
How can anyone convince people killing is wrong by judicial killing?
rauri |
mat9iou
Member
Gender: Male
Dikshita
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# Posted: 31 Dec 2006 15:46
Quoting: rauri They only tried him on charges that didn't need have evidence brought out that would have shown U.S. support for Saddam in the past.
This is exactly what I was thinking as well. Despite all these claims of mass graves he was tried for a crime that was relatively minor by comparison - This isn't a new thing though, When Al Capone was eventually imprisoned, it was for tax evasion.
It is interesting to note that the number of people whose death Saddam was charged with in the end seems to be about the same number who now killed in an average day in Iraq.
I still do not support the death penalty though - no matter who it is for. On the one hand you are criticizing the accused for their actions, but on the other hand your method of dealing with it shows that you are quite happy to do the same thing to them when the circumstances are different. Morally I think it is a lot easier to stand above the criminals if you can show that you do not behave in the same way as they do.
I don't think that anyone in their right minds would dispute the fact that Saddam was a horribly evil person who was responsible for many crimes. However, for much of the time he was committing these crimes he was supported by the west, not just through them ignoring what he did, but also through the provision of funding & weapons.
This video clip gives an alternative take on the issue - I don't agree with many of the things in the video but it does highlight a lot of matters that have ben deliberately brushed aside in recent years.
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Kama
Devadasi
Gender: Female
Rishi
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# Posted: 31 Dec 2006 19:32
Does anyone feel "safer" now Saddam is dead? ...and the new video showing Saddam being tormented seems to make the whole affair a vendetta killing.
I certainly agree that the trial was "staged" to keep American "crimes" out of the court room...
I believe Sex with Men is Divine and draws me closer to my Gods. Kama's website |
rauri
Member
Gender: N/A
Bhakta
|
# Posted: 1 Jan 2007 18:01
Quoting: mat9iou However, for much of the time he was committing these crimes he was supported by the west,
That is an interesting video you linked to.
I was reading that the C.I.A. was working with Saddam right back in 1959.
A couple of relevant articles here:
Robert Fisk writing in the Independant
A dictator created then destroyed by America
http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article16014.htm
and in the Guardian Comment.
Lynched by the mob:
http://commentisfree.guardian.co.uk/tariq_ali/2006/12/post_852.html
That Saddam was a tyrant is beyond dispute, but what is conveniently
forgotten is that most of his crimes were committed when he was a staunch ally of those who now occupy the country. It was, as he admitted in one of his trial outbursts, the approval of Washington (and the poison gas supplied by West Germany) that gave him the confidence to douse Halabja with chemicals in the midst of the Iran-Iraq war. He deserved a proper trial and punishment in an independent Iraq. Not this.
rauri |
BandR
Member
Gender: N/A
Bhakta
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# Posted: 2 Jan 2007 10:01
Iraq was an artificial state cobbled together in the 1920s by fiat by the worlds "powers" - in particular France and Britain. It did after much struggle attain a reasonable semblance of unity in the late 60s but the effect of the Saddam Hussein regime was similar the that of another "friend of the west": Josip Tito.
If you take the lid off a pressure cooker without cooling it down first you end up covered with hot soup.
BandR
xxx
PS. The death penalty is ALWAYS wrong.
I believe that Sex with Kama draws me closer to her gods. |
Kama
Devadasi
Gender: Female
Rishi
|
# Posted: 2 Jan 2007 22:26
The other fascinating thing is how US courts often seem indifferent to delaying executions so new DNA evidence might be submitted that could prove the innocence of a "guilty" person...
I believe Sex with Men is Divine and draws me closer to my Gods. Kama's website |
Kama
Devadasi
Gender: Female
Rishi
|
# Posted: 2 Jan 2007 22:29
...and isn't interesting that the government's are upset that the unofficial video is out all over the internet showing what really happened at the execution...
The government version is now exposed as cheap lies and theatre...
...and instead of bringing closure the execution has just increased tensions between the various communities...
I believe Sex with Men is Divine and draws me closer to my Gods. Kama's website |
rauri
Member
Gender: N/A
Bhakta
|
# Posted: 3 Jan 2007 14:51
Yep! The propaganda has backfired on them.
I have noticed how New Labour tries to put the spin on things and keeps
repeating. 'We got rid of Saddam.'
As if the war was some kind of altruistic crusade.
Rather than we went to war to protect Britain from WMD.
That was the old spin.
rauri |
Kama
Devadasi
Gender: Female
Rishi
|
# Posted: 3 Jan 2007 15:40
It is amazing how the supposedly great and the good could cock up something so important as Iraq...
You really get the feeling that they just didn't know what they were doing...
I believe Sex with Men is Divine and draws me closer to my Gods. Kama's website |
mat9iou
Member
Gender: Male
Dikshita
|
# Posted: 3 Jan 2007 21:07
Its also amazing just how so many other people seemed to be able to see how badly it was going to go wrong right from the start.
The problem is, that now when there really is an evil dictator who is building nuclear weapons to attack us, then no one is going to believe the government any more.
Its just like the story of the boy who cried wolf.
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rauri
Member
Gender: N/A
Bhakta
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# Posted: 4 Jan 2007 09:32
Quoting: Kama You really get the feeling that they just didn't know what they were doing...
What scares me a bit is that they might have intended this outcome.
i.e. a civil war and the partition of Iraq.
Or I might be thinking a bit too paranoid here?
Quoting: mat9iou no one is going to believe the government any more
I didn't think a great deal about politics until 2003 when the way our government acted was just outrageous.
It seemed to be against the will of most of the people and illegal.
The only explanation I could come up with at the time was they wanted to preserve the 'special relationship' the U.S. at all costs.
rauri |
hockberg
Member
Gender: Male
Bhakta
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# Posted: 24 Jan 2007 20:14
and the next generation will learn from our example: Video
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rauri
Member
Gender: N/A
Bhakta
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# Posted: 25 Jan 2007 09:41
Adults are setting a fine example of how to behave for children to follow.
I read that a young girl in Kolkata hung herself after watching that Saddam news report.
http://www.news24.com/News24/World/News/0,,2-10-1462_2051037,00.html
rauri |
Arawn
Member
Gender: Male
Dikshita
|
# Posted: 5 Apr 2007 12:21
The Shrubbery was out to get Iraq, long before Sammy ben Laden killed any innocents in this country, and we're now having "trouble" with the other part of Aryana.
Nice that the Pakistani Hindus are already devided.
Hasn't India a WMD Program?
Arawn
Would anyone be interested in the Holy Grail, or do people just want to talk about it? |
